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Massive Redfish, Black Drum, Trout, etc Kill Along Beaches-Fouchon/Elmer's Isle?

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Read on another webiste, there was a massive fish kill which had settled along the beaches from west of Fouchon to Elmer's Isle! It was stated that the stench was horrible...prior to and during the incident pogie boats/spotter planes reportedly were working the Gulf within a mile of the beaches! At the time, days before the Grand Isle Tarpon Rodeo-were were no picture/videos.

Anyone hear and/or see this in person?

If indeed true...hope the media has the cahoonas to do some coverage and the after-math!?!

John Castelluccio, Jr.
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Re: Massive Redfish, Black Drum, Trout, etc Kill Along Beaches-F
I have seen Breton Sound covered in dead bull reds many times. You can not tell me that it these fish kills are NOT from the pogey boats. I have seen it way too many times. I know it is a profitable business and several good products come from the harvesting of them, but over fishing of Menhaden is what killed the Chesapeake Bay area and the east coast years ago. You simply can not remove the major food source and not have a ecosystem collapse.
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Re: Massive Redfish, Black Drum, Trout, etc Kill Along Beaches-F
VERY well said Capt...
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Re: Massive Redfish, Black Drum, Trout, etc Kill Along Beaches-F
Here is a picture of a small part of the kill East of Fourchon.
Lots more breeder reds along beach and dead in surf.
If in fact the pogie operations are killing our breeding stock of redfish we are in real trouble.
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Re: Massive Redfish, Black Drum, Trout, etc Kill Along Beaches-F
Capt. Rory...THANK YOU for you input! especially from someone who is on our waters over 10 months a year!

ps: Have you heard from Ed McIntyre??? John Castelluccio, Jr.
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Re: Massive Redfish, Black Drum, Trout, etc Kill Along Beaches-F
Not in a long time John.
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Re: Massive Redfish, Black Drum, Trout, etc Kill Along Beaches-F
I'm going down to Elmers Weds, I'll let ya'll know how bad it is
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Re: Massive Redfish, Black Drum, Trout, etc Kill Along Beaches-F
PLS...be sure to take pic and videos!!!!
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Re: Massive Redfish, Black Drum, Trout, etc Kill Along Beaches-F
https://gulfhypoxia.net/wp-content/uploads/2018/07/2018_SW_BDO_2018-07-27_AtoI_web.jpg

Sampling in that area this month shows a large area of hypoxia that may be responsible for any reported fish kills.
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Re: Massive Redfish, Black Drum, Trout, etc Kill Along Beaches-F
If its on a beach, its most likely hypoxia, especially in the summer. Southwest Florida is currently struggling with this as well with HUGE fish kills hurting tourism. Hypoxia occurs offshore as well, but since the lack of oxygen is confined to the bottom in deep water, fish kills offshore are likely from something else (pogey boats are near the top of the list).

While hypoxia can occur naturally, a major culprit is also the high nutrients from agriculture runoff and waste-water treatment from river water.
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Re: Massive Redfish, Black Drum, Trout, etc Kill Along Beaches-F
MATHGEEK: SOOO correct...just see how quickly FLORIDA handles their smaller situation!! Costing the State tourist $$$...VERY QUICK RESPONSE(S)! LOUISIANA...NADA---oooh welll!

DR. SPOT: DOUBT SERIOUSLY river water cause(s) DUE TO OVER THREE WEEKS OF WESTERLY WINDS keeping river water EAST of the mouth of the Mississippi River!!!
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Re: Massive Redfish, Black Drum, Trout, etc Kill Along Beaches-F
Its not quite that simple. A lot of eddies form near the coast with counter currents. There are upwelling and downwelling episodes. Strong tidal flushing can bring river water flushing from the West Bay cut. The Atchafalaya River is also a source. Filaments of the offshore dead zone could get transported onshore.

There are also natural hypoxia episodes. If water becomes stratified near the coast due to heat and rapid density overturning, the water loses oxygen and fish die.

A solid monitoring program is needed in the shallow marine environment which is currently non-existent. But its not a state priority. Just like they turn a blind eye on the pogie industry.
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Re: Massive Redfish, Black Drum, Trout, etc Kill Along Beaches-F
Just got back from Elmers, I didn't see any fish kill there
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Re: Massive Redfish, Black Drum, Trout, etc Kill Along Beaches-F
What you can?t see in the pictures and video because of the glare are the hundreds dead fish rolling in the shallow water below the surf line...
https://www.facebook.com/CDub9/videos/10156727208440739/?t=0
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Re: Massive Redfish, Black Drum, Trout, etc Kill Along Beaches-F
John, there is no fish kill there....glare? we left because of the storms. Trust me as rough as it was out there....there wasn't anything rolling under the surf, it was coming on shore
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Re: Massive Redfish, Black Drum, Trout, etc Kill Along Beaches-F
STRANGE, statement/postS by charter Capt. Carpenter; pics from 'FantasyIsland'; video by CeeDub; Capt. Ty Hibbs; Chris Macaluso (Baton Rouge ADVOCATE) and even on 'Paradise Louisiana'...there was mention (during Grand Isle Rodeo week) of fish kills and rotting fish on the beach(es)!

INITIAL POST:
'Daryl Carpenter
July 27 at 8:16 PM
Guys I'm not trying to pick up another torch because I have enough of them that I am trying to keep lit now and run a business. But here is my tale of the last 48 hours. ......
.
Fished the beaches of Fourchon yesterday and caught a limit of trout before 9AM. As I was fishing I was looking toward the gulf and I observed the pogie fleet exercising their fishery, they were working the area hard. Fast forward to today .......
.
Fished the Fourcon beach again today and about mid morning noticed the crowds of boats coming further west. Reports were that there were hundreds of dead 'breeder reds' floating in the surf, washing up on the beach and the smell was horrible. I was west of it and the wind was out of the west so I did not notice it.
.
On the ride home to Grand Isle I passed hundreds of dead mature Redfish, Jack Cravelle, sharks and mixed in with them were 6 inch long pogies that could have only come from one place. There were hundreds of dead Reds and jacks washed up on the beach along the way.
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Re: Massive Redfish, Black Drum, Trout, etc Kill Along Beaches-F
Dude you asked me if I was going down there to give you a report, I'm chest deep in Elmers Isle waters but don't take my word.....don't ask again
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Re: Massive Redfish, Black Drum, Trout, etc Kill Along Beaches-F
Any pics/videos??? Just that!
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Re: Massive Redfish, Black Drum, Trout, etc Kill Along Beaches-F
The man was down on Elmers...in the water...and told you what he saw...which was nothing. What do you want a video/pictures of? The surf? I'm sure if there were anything substantial to report he would have said so.

Thanks 28-3 for taking the time to post what you saw.
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Re: Massive Redfish, Black Drum, Trout, etc Kill Along Beaches-F
Taken into consideration: Thank you BOTH! ...NEXT!!!???!!!
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Re: Massive Redfish, Black Drum, Trout, etc Kill Along Beaches-F
I get Capt. Rorry's point on destroying the base of the food chain and the ensuing effects on everything else higher up. But I'm confused about the report posted from Daryl Carpenter. It sounded like the pogie boats were causing the fish to die from something other than starvation. Almost like they die just because the boats were there, not from lacking nutrients due to the lower number of pogies. Do pogie boats cause large fish kills like this from something other than just robbing the food that everything else feeds on? Are they bringing bigger fish in as by-catch and killing them? Or somehow causing hypoxic conditions just from being there? Don't know much about pogie and menhaden fishing other than passing a boat or two and putting the hammer down to get the hell away from the smell and birds.
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Re: Massive Redfish, Black Drum, Trout, etc Kill Along Beaches-F
It is not about the boats taking the food away from the predators causing the kills. It is the predators getting caught in the nets. They use huge purse seines that are corralled around the large schools of pogys. These schools are usually spotted by the commotion of jack, sharks, and reds feeding on the schools of pogys. No one can tell me that those nets do not catch everything in the water and that our game fish are not being slaughtered as bycatch. Pogys are the base of the food chain so if the pogy industry is not kept in check it could cause a total collapse of our fishery.
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Re: Massive Redfish, Black Drum, Trout, etc Kill Along Beaches-F
Back in the '80's, I used to fish West Bay twice a week every other week. We caught large specs, croakers, bull reds, jacks & blacktips. Fishing was incredible. Then the pogie boats moved in. Within months, fishing went to the outhouse. When the boats left, a trail of dead fish 200 yards wide and as far as you could see remained. Nets are indiscriminate. They kill everything. Pogie boats should be outlawed!!!
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Re: Massive Redfish, Black Drum, Trout, etc Kill Along Beaches-F
Pogie boats are indescribably awful for a fishery. In the south we have the most relaxed laws managing their operations. On the east coast they are regulated way more than down here. I doubt anything will ever change for them down here as its a billion dollar industry and our politicians won't go near that.

http://www.daybrook.com/about/

Daybrook is the plant in Empire and partners with a company based in South Africa.

Omega Protein is another large company that operates in Mississippi.

They will never go completely away but would be ideal to have restrictions on how close to shore they could net the pogie.
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Re: Massive Redfish, Black Drum, Trout, etc Kill Along Beaches-F
I wonder if we will see a decline in menhaden stocks as MS. River diversions expand? Tons of Asian carp are introduced to esturarine nurseries through these diversions where they compete with juvenile menhaden for food . Unfortunately, many other native freshwater, estuarine and marine fisheries stocks may decline as well. I guess the question is, ' will there be a decline in our coastal fisheries as Asian carp introductions increase?'
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Re: Massive Redfish, Black Drum, Trout, etc Kill Along Beaches-F
N O W... Is the time to start contacting our 'Legislators' (both House and State Reps) in reference to restrictions on this industry which is depleting the basic ecosystem for sustenance along the food chain which is alternately depleting the redfish, trout, jackfish, etc species. This type is industry is running rampant with very few restrictions IF ANY....Billions of dollars to the few!

The Gulf Coast Management Association has a 'hands-off' attitude as compared to the Atlantic Fisheries Management which has seen the devastation to their fisheries industry and has started/continues to stringently control the pogey industry along the eastern seaboard.

We should remind our ELECTED officials that THEIR FUTURE IS IN OUR HANDS and they should listen to what we have seen, what we are saying and what is being indicated by past events and the affect on our future fisheries.

Our sport, recreational and chartered industry contributes more to our economic businesses than what this pogey industry minimally gives back to Our State's Economy! J

REMEMBER THIS DURING OUR NOVEMBER ELECTION PERIOD!

John Castelluccio, Jr.
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Re: Massive Redfish, Black Drum, Trout, etc Kill Along Beaches-F
First off, let me clear the air, I am not from Louisiana but I come down every year and I really love your state and fishery! I hope the fish kill is not true, but if it is, I doubt it has anything to do with the pogie fishing. Louisiana Sportsman did an article about this fishery several years ago. They even state that the redfish and speckled trout bycatch is minimal. Here is the link http://www.louisianasportsman.com/details.php?id=5576 .

As a non-resident, I am always shocked to see the coolers full of fish being taken off the water everyday (evidenced at the ramps and the photos on this forum). To me, that is worse than the shown fish kill. I know that the marshes offer great masses of fish, but I am surprised more people to not practice catch and release. Trust me, I am not trying to cause controversies or ruffle feathers, but only stating my opinion/observations.

Tight lines and see you again in November!
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Re: Massive Redfish, Black Drum, Trout, etc Kill Along Beaches-F
The difference is that there are scientists who have come up with the limits for Louisiana and have been proven to be sustainable.

I think if the pogie boats were restricted (not banned) to fish a certain distance from shore the impact and increase in fish would be noticeable. Its not just them killing fish from by catch. Its also that they remove a mind boggling amount of food from the ecosystem. More food = more fish that can survive.

On the east coast where pogie boats were regulated more heavily the fishing improved drastically.

Is our fishing great? absolutely but it could be even better.
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Re: Massive Redfish, Black Drum, Trout, etc Kill Along Beaches-F
Granted fish kills caused by pogy boats don't happen all the time, but I have seen it happen plenty enough times.
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Re: Massive Redfish, Black Drum, Trout, etc Kill Along Beaches-F
Cauht1: As Capt. Rory Rorison mentioned previously---

FIRST OF ALL...we have a size minimum and a per fish limit on all saltwater species which is authorized by the Louisiana Wildlife and Fisheries in conjunction with biological data to substantiate/allow these limits!

SECOND OF ALL: There is statistical proof that NOT EVERYONE catches their allowable limit(s)...I BELIEVE that figure is around 10%!?!

THIRD OF ALL: Those catching 'limits' are most likely chartered trips---AND THOSE HAVE BEEN FAR AND IN BETWEEN! This is evidenced by the LACK of fishing (bragging) reports.

FOURTH OF ALL: I hope you come OFTEN to our bountiful State to share its beauty, co-mingle with our residents, AND REAP SOME OF WHAT OUR STATE IS KNOWN FOR...ie: FOOD - FISHING - FRIENDS!

LASTLY: Until you witness the damage that the bogie-industry is doing to a basic-link in our saltwater fisheries eco-system ( REMOVING unrestrictedly that link to sustain our fisheries offshore)---pogey/menhaden! That is the very reason almost ALL of the entire Atlantic seaboard States have basically disallowed the pogey industry to harvest in its States' waterways!

Sincerely...John Castelluccio, Jr.
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